don't speak German? -> you'll receive bad service almost everywhere -> you won't get in to a lot of good clubs etc.

don't look like German? -> you'll get stares -> you'll be second rate / tourist / something

like drugs? like to party from 01AM to the afternoon of the next day? -> you'll love it

like sightseeing / going to the "best" places? -> everything's spread around a pretty big area -> you'll take the train / taxi / bus pretty often

like pretty buildings? -> in general, Berlin is ugly and crude. Except for the rich people areas and some places in downtown.

Partying two days without sleeping in the same club with a wide variety of substances is normal. There are weird sex club party thingies. There are ug techno parties with all kinds of debauchery. There are parks with more drug dealers than other people. Definitely not conservative, but somewhat xenophobic.

I don't look German at all and have been living in berlin for 10 years. Never had this feeling.

...that being said, I'm Spanish and am sure that a guy from Pakistan will sadly get more looks, so YMMV.

And as for the city, came on! Berlin is so much more than clubs and drugs.

Berlin has a vibrant tech culture with user groups, meetups, conferences and hack groups. Probably the biggest scene in Europe.

Berlin has a cultural offer second to no other in the world. If you really like a band and want to watch them live, just wait and they'll come over.

Whatever you enjoy, you can find it in Berlin. Period.

Reducing Berlin to just clubs and drugs is absolutely ridiculous.

Spain has obviously better weather, that's a thing I miss from Spain.

The salaries are better in Germany, and I would say the working conditions are also better.

That's of course all my anecdotal experience, so YMMV. All but the weather.

And the food I guess? :)

Barca = Premium Berlin

> don't look like German? -> you'll get stares -> you'll be second rate / tourist / something

That depends on the corner of Berlin though.

There are plenty of user groups, technical meetups, hackerspaces, makerspaces:

c-base, Chaos Computer Club, Linux User Groups, JavaScript/Python/Haskell/PHP/... User Groups, Free Software Foundation local group, Wikipedia/Wikimedia stuff, Makerspaces, ...

Every evening more than one to choose from.

At those place - essentially, at every slightly nerdy place - everybody will try their best to talk to English with you, or the meetup will have English language and presentations in the first place, anyway. And people from different corners of the world are seen there as enriching and interesting people to talk with.

Ymmv

- 5k/month -> 60k/year sounds reasonable in general. You might be able to get more, but honestly I don't think that's a bad salary for programming position. Tax sounds about right.

- 24 days of leave seems on the low side of things. I'd expect 28-30 OR more pay. I had 30 in Germany.

- 1500 for the relocation seems low as well. What are you supposed to pay for with that? Flight is covered by the company? What about housing (usually you have 1-2 month of rent to deposit, that might eat a large chunk of this amount already)?

Can't comment on the neighborhood or the current cost of living situation in Berlin, but I feel that I'd stay in Dubai if I were in your shoes. You earn quite a lot of money for later - 12*4k + 5k means that you basically nearly save all the money Germany offers before taxes. You are happy at your company. You fly home for free - no idea how expensive flights between Dubai and Pakistan are, for me this is quite expensive (Singapore -> Germany).

Let me turn this question around: What is it that you _like_ about the offer? Just getting out of "Can never stay forever" Dubai/a different tech zone alone or is the job/location itself interesting?

- The tech scene, lots of meetups and exposure

- Lots of big companies and startups

to name a few.

21 months + good german -> PR

33 months + a bit of german -> PR

I've been to Dubai for vacation, and I found it pretty boring TBH. In Europe you'll have more opportunities to find something interesting, even if now you're a type of guy who would spend much of his time in front of the laptop. Maybe that's because there is just boring in Dubai?

So there usually is no need at all to save a lot of money just in case, which makes the high tax rate pretty bearable.

Comparing salary plus benefits is really hard. OP should try to put a number on the value of health insurance etc in Germany.

I didn't move to Berlin and my reasons were little different. If I were to suggest you I would say move to Berlin and the strongest point is you can get National there with in 3 to 4 years. second strong point is Berlin is turning into European Tech Hub exposure you can get while living Berlin you can't get in Dubai.

Go to Berlin ;)

For apartment, prepare to spend around €800 peek around here:

http://www.wg-gesucht.de/wg-zimmer-in-Berlin.8.0.1.0.html

Monthly expenses for food, drinks, socializing would be anywhere between €300 - €600

Try to calculate your net salary:

http://www.parmentier.de/steuer/steuer.htm?wagetax.htmt

On 2900 net, I'm not sure if I moved there although I lived on significantly less money :)

In my opinion, Berlin is a much better place (even with that weather) than Dubai except if you are Java engineer with interest in banking apps like Murex/Calypso/etc. If that's your case, stay in Dubai or switch to Singapore in the next 2-4 years. After that period, you can fly to whenever you like in Europe working in the bank and place you want.

Bureaucratic stuff can take time in Germany. Learning the language can challenging. The language schools have very different quality of teaching.

London has a much larger population of immigrants from the Middle East. So if your prospective employer in Berlin had a London office, or business ties to the UK, that would be a plus.

> - 24 holidays per year

This is the minimum you have to get for full-time employment in Germany. In many companies you can negotiate more. (worth noting for the future)

I don't know much about Dubai, but from what I understand you'd also have much more to do in Germany. Easier travel to interesting places as well, since you can't throw a rock around there without hitting something historic.

Generally, I'd expect 30 days. That's still the norm.

24 screams "startup" or "we struggled to offer that salary, so we're compensating with less holiday".

I'm mostly the same, and live in a medium-sized city near Berlin (Dresden). For your reference, my monthly costs are around 1200 € per month, breaking down as follows (all numbers monthly):

- rent and utilities: 420€ (for a 50 sqm apartment)

- internet: 40€ (100 Mib/s, including landline)

- TV: 25€ (most of it is the mandatory fee for public broadcasting)

- cellphone: 10€ (1 GiB monthly allowance)

- voluntary insurances: 80€ (mostly disability insurance; not including health and unemployment insurance since those are deducted from the salary before I get the payout)

- public transit pass: 50€ (valid for all modes of public transport across the entire town; I don't own a car)

- food: 300€ (I could cut a good third of that if I pre-cooked my lunch at home instead of going to restaurants for lunch with my colleagues)

The rest is small stuff (homewares, drugstore items, medicine), entertainment expenses (cinema ticket, train ticket to a hiking spot, etc.), and a monthly donation of 100 € to my local hackerspace. If I had to, I could cut the donation and the expensive lunches and go down to ~1000€ per month immediately.

But that's Dresden, not Berlin. The rent is bound to be much higher in Berlin (at least per sqm; you might find something under 500€ if you really compromise on space, but actual Berliners can tell you more about this line item than I can). Also, public transit is more expensive in Berlin because of the larger tariff zones. AFAIK, a month pass for Berlin public transit would set you back around 100€. The other expenses should be nearly identical. My educated guess for cost of living in Berlin at my standard (which presumably is somewhere around yours) is 1500€ per month.

Maybe add another 100€ for evening classes in German language, which I would definitely recommend if you're staying longer than a few months.

As others have mentioned, you'll pay more taxes and you'll be left with less net income, but the amount of social security you get in return is totally worth it. Plus, there's more than enough tech companies in Berlin, so I am sure you can increase your salary over time.

You can build up a better future in Europe than in Dubai, but there are more taxes.

from here: https://www.internations.org/germany-expats/guide/15984-soci...

If I were you, I wouldn't move.

Running the tax calculator here:

http://www.brutto-netto-rechner.info/

it says you get 3.275,61 € after tax for 5000 € / month.

However, that already covers all the insurance costs, health insurance, insurance against loss of employment and pension insurance.

And health insurance in germany is a "real" insurance that won't try to get rid of you in case you get severely ill (cancer etc.). Even includes compensatory payments in case you're unfit for work (although your employer may have the right to terminate you if there is no chance of you recovering)

Things I like: - Berlin is nice city to live in, cheap to transport (bike, shared bikes/cars, nice public transport)

- very cheap and good quality basic groceries - meat, dairies, pastry is really cheap with great basic quality and you can always go for organic and more expensive variants, cheap restaurants and bars, relatively inexpensive housing

- Berlin has decent flight connections around Europe + easily reachable Amsterdam, Prague, Copenhagen by car

- No crazy workaholic culture (nothing compared to the US), lot of holidays and taking a sick leave is easy and covered by law, 8 hours of work per day

- Nice engineering meetups and community

Things I dislike: - getting a decent apartment might be really difficult now days, even more difficult than getting a job

- Berlin is not so visually pleasing

- sometimes it's difficult if you dont speak german well

- winter is not so cold but very dark and grey

That being said, 3.2k is a good salary in Germany, and housing in Berlin is not as expensive as in Hamburg or Munich, 1000€ will get you a spacious flat for 1 person, utilities included. Food is cheap in Germany, if you can cook a few hounded € per month are enough.

My guess would be that if you have a decent lifestyle, find a not too pricey flat, you can save between around 1000€ per month.

- fluency in German will be a big factor for long-term happiness. Becoming fluent will take a long time.

- Germany (and most of Western Europe) is not the world leader in take-home pay. People here typically spend 25-30% of their income on rent, another 30% on other expenses, and maybe save the rest. Germans are frugal but saving more than 30% is pretty rare for sure. Spending to cover the bare essentials and saving the rest is not a typical way of life here. If you're saving for something big then maybe stay in Dubai or go to, say, Switzerland?

I came to London as a developer about 14 years ago! Now married (an Indian), children here, British Citizen, etc. Travel to UAE almost every year en route to India, etc.

My advice: - You are the right age and no responsibility to explore the world, so that is worth considering.

- Also, think long term, you can't make moves everyday. Will you be happy if one thing leads to another and you live in Germany for the rest of your life with children, etc?

- I miss my extended family in the UAE but meet frequently as its much more common for people to fly around these days.

I think with 60k income the taxes are 28%, but there's health insurance and social security insurance, too.

I heard that finding a flat is currently not easy in Berlin. Bergmannstrasse is a lovely "Kiez" (neighborhood).

The scene in Berlin for programmers is nice, lots of meetups (if you are interested in that).

Even considering all of this you are losing out on a lot of money moving to Berlin. I left Dubai to work remotely in CPH and love it so far

Long term pension, medical and schooling for kids, much more stable & much more opportunities than UAE. Taxes pay for themselves. However, in UAE with new vat and growing hidden taxes are high. You can even buy a house and it is like living rent free! The rents in Dubai are high and buying for long term is not recommended.

Longer term you can even look at moving to London if you like to stay in a English speaking country.

- Berlin is a beautiful city; a lot of parks and stuff to do. I personally spend more time outside.

- You would move to Berlin to live a happier life, not for making a shit-ton of money.

- your salary is in the low/mid side of Seniors, they usually make 55-70K brutto, but not a bad one to start with IMHO.

- Expect to search for flat for at least 3-4 weeks, Berlin's housing space is complicated currently.

Do you like Berlin? Do you see yourself there? Do you want to live in the EU? Are you comfortable with the culture?

Yes you should move to Berlin if you have the chance to get permanent residency or even the citizenship. If you live in Germany, you live in Europe and can relocate to another country within the EU easily. The German citizenship is THE most valuable in the world ( http://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/lists/most-powerful-passpo... ). The German economy is one of the strongest in the world. You'll live in a free, welcoming and open democracy. I wouldn't care so much about the perks, but about the fact that you're in the EU, and specifically in Germany.

ps: If you got so far to get a job offer with relocation in Germany, you'll also easily find another job here. Maybe not in Berlin, but Munich for example has all the big names: Google, Microsoft, IBM, Autodesk, Salesforce, (the list goes on and is really long).

Do you want to become financially independent, move back to Pakistan, and retire early? A couple of years in Dubai seems like a good choice.

Do you want to move to Europe for its infrastructure, healthcare, culture, etc? Berlin is great!

That said, it's a gateway to Europe; if you can somehow get a working permit valid in all of Europe, or a path to citizenship, that would be a fantastic opportunity.

A.) I want to live in Berlin B.) I do not want to live in Dubai

As far as the offer goes, I would argue for, in order, 1) more holiday; 2) slightly more pay (maybe 2k Euros per year); 3) more on the relocation if it is a lump sum; 4) more for educational budget. For a senior position, the salary is decent (from my understanding at or above market rate) but the vacation is slightly low (only 4 days above the statutory minimum). On the relocation negotiation, if they don't offer a lump sum, it's probably not worth to negotiate unless you have a lot of things to move. I've never heard of a company offering a flight back every year so it's unlikely it would be offered directly.

As far as saving and money, you can realistically find an apartment by yourself in a nicer part of town for no more than €900-1000 warm per month, but you can definitely save money if you live with a flatmate, live further away, or get a smaller flat. After taxes you'd probably take home about €3000, which means if you had the more lavish flat, you would have €2000 for food, transit, etc. My understanding is that Berlin is relatively cheap for food, so you would struggle to spend more than €500-600 per month even if you ate out often, and you would of course spend less if you cooked your own food. Being conservative and saying you spend €1000 per month on all of your expenditures, you could look at saving, minimum, €1000 per month. If you live frugally you could definitely save more, but with a €5000 per month salary it's going to be impossible to save €4000 per month due to taxes. If saving significantly is very important to you, it would be really bothersome for you.

As far as comparing living in the two places, a lot of other commenters have mentioned about residency, in that if you're university educated, you can get the Blue Card and get permanent residency within 3 years. If you don't have a degree, I think you can get it in 5 (possibly expedited if you can speak German well). Berlin is also quite diverse for Germany, and likely has more job opportunities than Dubai as it doesn't stick to large corporations and the financial sector, especially if you already have experience in Berlin as they won't have to deal with the documents for visa purposes and you would have a better understanding of "how German companies work". The job security in Germany is very high, insofar that it's really difficult to get fired after the initial six months of your contract, but you must also give 3 months notice to your company when you want to leave. Berlin is also quite easy to travel from and to in Europe, via train, bus, and flight, although I understand that Dubai is easy to travel around central Asia and western Europe, so it might be a wash, and maybe a negative in your case since you'll likely be flying further to go back home. Berlin likely has a lot more meetups and networking, and you can use your education budget for conference(s) for networking as well.

Overall, the offer sounds decent (better if you can negotiate), and if you find Berlin more appealing than Dubai I would go for the offer and the opportunity to move. Just keep in mind your priorities (seems the bigger ones are saving and residency, but there must be others you didn't mention) when making the decision, since you are content at your current job and it would be a big move.

You'd have to go to Berlin to see what I mean.

I wish I could explain it better, but my family is a migrant family from the Caribbean to the USA and their move involved costs/benefits similar to yours, and that's my overall impression.

A small apartment, or a room is around 400 EUR warm if you have little claim to location and equipment. Find out more at immonet. de. The user interface is simple and even if you don't know German, you should be able to use it.

The cost of living for a geek who lives sparingly would be 400 EUR per month. Insurance and miscellaneous costs 150 EUR.

Leaves you with 5000 * 0,5 - 400 - 400 - 400 - 150 = 1550 EUR should be doable as a monthly saving. With a buffer, a monthly saving of 1400 EUR should be possible.

60000 EUR annual salary is ok for the beginning. If you perform well, you should earn a six-digit salary as a Senior Software Engineer, especially in Hamburg, Munich and Düsseldorf. To do this, however, you would have to set the right course at your first job in Germany and not start with less than 75,000.