It started as a civilian resistance for excessive police force. Unique and special part of this movement was political distribution of people in it. Erdogan's party rule 3'rd times the government. At this point they changed from independent, democrat, liberal party to totaliter one. So people in the movement is consist of multiple former Akp (Erdogan's party) supporter, too. That's why it should be important for Erdogan. But instead he's arguing that most of them provoked by other forces so ignoring.
But now, 3'rd day of activity, it changed from civilian movement to anarchist, provokative anti-governmental and mostly illegal movements. That's why now people should calm down. Because initial point of movement succeed it's purpose. Park is safe (court decision), police is off the Taksim Square.
ps: i'm talkin as person who was in activity actually and hurted by police brutality. #direngeziparki
I've been there in Ankara protests last 2 days / nights.
I have several light burns around my body. Got hit by a gas canister. Seen people shot down with plastic bullets and got sprayed with an orange liquid that burns like hell.
The PM says social media is a damnation of god and we had several outages of twitter and facebook.
Non-violence is the greatest force at the disposal of mankind. It is mightier than the mightiest weapon of destruction devised by the ingenuity of man.
While I'm glad that people from Turkey are voicing there opinions here, I think there is also danger in being too credulous. The people who use English speaking social media are not necessarily representative of the whole population and the fact that people are able to spread their message on social media doesn't make them right.
I am still waiting to see confirmation of the existence of a media blackout in Turkey by the mainstream media, and the more general claims about the current regime are even harder to judge for an outsider.
Yeah you're absolutely right. While I'm in protest, my father in another city talkin about provocateurs about us without knowing I'm part of it (btw not a provocateur). So there is two side of coin. About media blackout, there's no official claims but all media company are heavily in business with government so they can do it without any official requests. Which they did it because media during protests only broadcast cartoon movies and other stupid stuff.
Here is the biggest mobile network of Turkey Turkcell -> http://ireport.cnn.com/docs/DOC-981808
Uh, I am moving there at the end of the summer. That is pretty much last thing I want to see at the moment.
I am hoping they manage to finish this thing before.
Although, I would prefer Turkey to be peaceful, I do understand and agree with these protest.
If there happens the worst case scenario and real revolution, does anyone have info, how safe it is after that usually?
sorry @DocG but I don't think revolutions happen that often to be able to say how safe they are with any kind of statistical significance :)
But as far as I can tell, the government seems to be starting to accept the blame and even Erdogan will probably fall in line in a few days. It probably won't escalate anymore. I wouldn't worry if I were you.
There might be parks within the walls of a gated community. Or there might be special parks, like a bird park or a japanese garden you might then need a ticket to enter.
Gezi Park is a public area in the heart of Istanbul. The value of the land must be astronomical. That's another reason why the government has no issues attacking the civilians. And they get this brutal because the value of each individual life (in their minds) is very very low.
(I used to live 500 meters away from Gezi Park, and I have spent a considerable amount of time there)
Pretty sure if Turkey falls we'll end up with a new Islamic caliphate in the next 10 years. Who doesn't see one sweeping over this shattered region. For 90% of its history (600 to 1900) the middle east has been under a single empire or another. What we should really be afraid of is some kind of galvanizing leader or force to come out of this.
Nationalism is a thing, you know. The Turks look down on the Kurds and the Arabs, the Levantine Arabs think the Mashreqis are a bunch of hicks with oil, the Maghrebien middle and upper class are very French indeed and Iran is Shi'ite and will not be having anything to do with the Turks or Arabs if possible. And the ex-Soviet stans have two, three generations of official atheism.
I could see, maybe, the unification of some of the Arab states but that's really about it, and I wouldn't bet that way. Pan-Arab nationalism probably reached its apotheosis with Nasser in the 70's. This is not to say that the next twenty or thirty years will be wine and roses. Yemen is going to look like a vision of hell for one thing.
Bullshit. They've had a common enemy for sixty years and it hasn't enabled them to overcome their differences. Different nations are different. Turkey is completely unique. Look at their system of government, it's secular, and has been for years, and they got there on their own. The Arab Spring protesters were very mixed, but largely Islamist. These protesters are largely secular. Look at Iran. I'd say it's much more likely they secularize their government in the next ten years than any kind of substantial caliphate spring into existence.
Having a caliphate was one thing when you had one rich city-state dominating a vast poor expanse. It's a very different story when you have a dozen rich countries, each with their own tiny army, each with their own couple ethnicities, each one wanting to pronounce everything differently and quite unable to agree on who succeeded Mohammed.
It would be really convenient to be able to paint all our troubles with a single brush and a single color of paint, but the truth is much more complex and interesting.
>> For 90% of its history (600 to 1900) the middle east has been under a single empire or another.
That is so totally wrong I don't even know where to begin. For starters the caliphate was only a political force until the emergence of the seljuk turks. The turkish empire was European focused and never controlled persia or arabia.
Persia was never an Ottoman posession but Arabia was, or at least most of it was. I'm too lazy to look it up on my phone. Caliph was among the titles claimed by the Ottoman Sultan and his claim was taken seriously by almost all Sunnis, particularly after the dethronement of the Mughals.
They didn't consider it among their more important titles until quite late, preferrimg Qaysar-i-Rum or Emperor of the Romans, but their claim to the Caliphate was long standing.
'Not allowing it to happen' would probably be the most galvanizing thing the world could possibly do. Basically damned if we do, damned if we don't. That's why a new caliphate seems like a real possible outcome. Also a new Islamic empire would most likely ally with Russia and China. Already they veto action on anything middle east related in the UN.
You seem to think that the various factions in the Middle East, just because they share a common religion, actually like each other. Even their religion has a few divisions that really don't like each other. Really, I doubt that you'll see any sort of large unified Middle East. It is just too hard to get them to agree on anything.
ps: i'm talkin as person who was in activity actually and hurted by police brutality. #direngeziparki